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Hi everybody,
In Lydian mode IIIB/minor+5. I don't understand why is named minor +5 a chord witch is more a minorb6. And what is the interest to concidering this tone has a #5 if it contain a 5?

Where am I wrong?

cheers

Thanks. But your response confuse me more

The (-7#5) resides on (VI) of the AuxDim.

on VI of the auxdim I can see Dim min chords in the Chart A not a -7#5?

It is a little confusing using both the 5 and #5 in this chord.
Voiced down from the top note C in close position it's a Cmaj7
which makes more sense, though he names it from the bass(E)
An inversion of modal tonic 1 chords !! (from the 59 edition)

I haven't explored the use of this chord much yet, but now it occurs to me that the backing machine I use for practice doesn't even offer it. But since it does support slash chords I'm going to try a C sus4 / A... It should be the same thing. Perhpas it would be ok to think of this chord as a Vsus4 / III in the Lydian universe...?

ML, could you please explain a bit more what you meant by stressing the importance of this chord? Is it interchangeable with the rest of Lydian chords in the same way, or is it special/different in some way?

Thanks, and all the best,
m

Later edit:

Only now I've included this chord in my 'chart' which shows the order of birth for different chords according to Russells Order of Tonal Gravity:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzznNG ... sp=sharing

and come to realize certain things... When you start stacking fifths above a Tonic, as soon as you've included 4 fifths above it, you've got the material to build a m7+5 chord (on the III degree with regards to the starting Tonic / LC Scale). Actually it's the first of 'common' chords that can be built on that degree. Also, of note is that the m7+5 is 'given birth' by the order of tonal gravity at the same moment (when you've included the fourth fifth above the Tonic) as the m7 chord (though this twin-sister/brother - m7 has it's root on the VIth degree). You need yet one more fifth above the Tonic to be able to construct a m, m7, 7sus4 or sus4 on the IIIrd degree. Maybe that explains why it makes sense to relate the III degree to m7+5 chord sooner than to some other chords. Also, it perhaps shows that m+5 is not some kind of a artificial intruder, but one of primary chords of equall dignity as Maj or m7. What a silly omission to have been ignoring this chord... A withdraw my earlier proposition to call this chord Vsus4 / III, it deserves to be used and called princpially as m+5 just like the man said.

Thanks for sharing your knowledge. It's very very interesting.
Can you tell me how you find your 144 intervals. Is something do do with the pythagorean tuning http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagorean_tuning?
And how you find de 15 aux dim scale intervals. Is this
Unison, b2, 2, b3 , 3, 4 ,#4 ,b5 (same as #4), 5, #5 , b6 (same as #5), 6 ,b7, 7 ,octave
?

Thanks, I love your thought 'hooks'! But I need one clarification:

motherlode wrote:The (-7#5) resides on (VI) of the AuxDim.

AuxDim should be: I II bIII IV +IV +V VI VII
So, and F AuxDim: F G Ab Bb B C# D E
I don't see how a -7#5 can sit on it's VI degree,
as it would need to be composed as: D F A#/Bb C
so we are missing the C (V) in the AuxDim...

Or have I misunderstood something?

Thanks!
m

I've been a fan of the Minor 7 #5 sound for years, probably from listening to so much Steely Dan growing up

Matoi nailed it when he said "When you start stacking fifths above a Tonic, as soon as you've included 4 fifths above it, you've got the material to build a m7+5 chord (on the III degree)"

Motherlode REALLY nailed it with "realize that the MELODY is infinitely more important than the chord"

I used to view this chord family as a 'rarity' (more of an 'altered minor' than anything), but with LCC I came to embrace it as a HUGELY important color, and one of my favorite tools to use harmonically. I did a reharm of the Beatles' "Yesterday" a while back using a bunch of Min 7 #5 sounds, and it's amazing - mostly because the melody is so strong, but also because the flavor of this particular chord is so harmonically flexible. Certainly an avenue worth persuing if you haven't already!