my vocabulary (or lack thereof...) implored me to seek a dictionary definition of "dialectic", and i confess (yet again) that my understanding may still be incomplete - in any case, i am intrigued by the concept of a "random" bass line. in the context of a harmonic environment (chords, whether traditional or non-traditional, definable or otherwise), even a "random" bass line will be perceived according to the "prevailing tonal gravity" of the music as a whole; so at the risk of appearing overly philosophical (who me?), let me pose the obvious question: is there any possibility of a random part in a piece of music being perceived as such? the principles of tonal gravity necessitate that even a random musical line exhibit characteristics of a tonal center (hindemith and russell both seem to state, implicitly and explicitly in their writings, that atonality cannot exist) - LCC calls it tonal gravity; hindemith points to the overtone series itself. an exercise that an instructor gave me once was to play a musical line with "no structure whatsoever" - and it didn't take long to discover just how difficult that was (perhaps impossible)...
either way, i find the concept of randomness in music to be bordering on the self-contradictory: once the "random" musical line has been stated, it can be repeated, developed, analyzed, and is therefore no longer random. i guess the most random thing you could do would be to construct a die with eighty-eight sides to represent the range of tones normally used in equal temperament and keep "rolling the dice", as it were, to continue the random piece of music; however, some parameters of timbre, duration, and countless varieties of dynamics must be stated in advance in order to proceed...
but to reiterate my point after so much rambling, even tones generated randomly will have a tonal component defined by tonal gravity, which according to the concept, is a purely natural phenomenon - given to us by nature itself, and not merely our expectations, cultural or otherwise...
random thoughts anyone???
Bass Lines
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An open letter from Alice Russell. June 21, 2011, Brookline, Massachusetts. 1. DO NOT make insulting, mean spirited remarks about anyone or their work; there are a plethora of sites where you can rant unfettered. If you attack someone personally, your comments will be removed. You can post it, but I'm not paying for it. Go elsewhere, and let those artists who are actually interested in discussion and learning have the floor. 2. There will be NO posting of or links to copyrighted material without permission of the copyright owner. That's the law. And if you respect the work of people who make meaningful contributions, you should have no problem following this policy. 3. I appreciate many of the postings from so many of you. Please don't feel you have to spend your time "defending" the LCC to those who come here with the express purpose of disproving it. George worked for decades to disprove it himself; if you know his music, there's no question that it has gravity. And a final word: George was famous for his refusal to lower his standards in all areas of his life, no matter the cost. He twice refused concerts of his music at Lincoln Center Jazz because of their early position on what was authentically jazz. So save any speculation about the level of him as an artist and a man. The quotes on our websites were not written by George; they were written by critics/writers/scholars/fans over many years. Sincerely, Alice
An open letter from Alice Russell. June 21, 2011, Brookline, Massachusetts. 1. DO NOT make insulting, mean spirited remarks about anyone or their work; there are a plethora of sites where you can rant unfettered. If you attack someone personally, your comments will be removed. You can post it, but I'm not paying for it. Go elsewhere, and let those artists who are actually interested in discussion and learning have the floor. 2. There will be NO posting of or links to copyrighted material without permission of the copyright owner. That's the law. And if you respect the work of people who make meaningful contributions, you should have no problem following this policy. 3. I appreciate many of the postings from so many of you. Please don't feel you have to spend your time "defending" the LCC to those who come here with the express purpose of disproving it. George worked for decades to disprove it himself; if you know his music, there's no question that it has gravity. And a final word: George was famous for his refusal to lower his standards in all areas of his life, no matter the cost. He twice refused concerts of his music at Lincoln Center Jazz because of their early position on what was authentically jazz. So save any speculation about the level of him as an artist and a man. The quotes on our websites were not written by George; they were written by critics/writers/scholars/fans over many years. Sincerely, Alice
Mr. Dogbite, I think you have mastered the Dialectic. Bravo.
The Ch'an (Chinese Zen) artists @1200 (I defer to Bob for precision) began teaching novices by having them put 'random' dots on paper until they realized there is no such thing. We impose images on clouds. Chaos theory. Bob A's cgonet cmnmoet. What I infer from Sandy's cgonet cmnmoet. One could interpret LCC as putting a tonic before and after the other 11 letters. 'Free Improv' is embedded in, at minimum' in a cultural narrative, i.e., one's world. Your response is the dialectic anthesis to the un-named composer's (hereafter 'Zorro' ( I have a 'release of information' re: confidentiality habit)) thesis.
'Free Jazz' has/had its geniuses (Coleman, Taylor, The Art Ensemble, SME). The curtain came down on my 'Free Impov' series (Milwaukee Jazz Gallery @ 30 years ago) when it appeared that the local rules were: no melody, no harmony, no rhythm, no emotion, no humor (One has yet to encounter wisdom without humor). Thus, free music became to me, the most restrictive form of all. Not throwing out the bbay with the btah wtear (When I get that down, perhaps (to paraphrase a recent pm from a wise man) Bob Bb & Bob A# become an enharmonic tonic station.)), 'free improv' is part of one's postmodern palette.
The Ch'an (Chinese Zen) artists @1200 (I defer to Bob for precision) began teaching novices by having them put 'random' dots on paper until they realized there is no such thing. We impose images on clouds. Chaos theory. Bob A's cgonet cmnmoet. What I infer from Sandy's cgonet cmnmoet. One could interpret LCC as putting a tonic before and after the other 11 letters. 'Free Improv' is embedded in, at minimum' in a cultural narrative, i.e., one's world. Your response is the dialectic anthesis to the un-named composer's (hereafter 'Zorro' ( I have a 'release of information' re: confidentiality habit)) thesis.
'Free Jazz' has/had its geniuses (Coleman, Taylor, The Art Ensemble, SME). The curtain came down on my 'Free Impov' series (Milwaukee Jazz Gallery @ 30 years ago) when it appeared that the local rules were: no melody, no harmony, no rhythm, no emotion, no humor (One has yet to encounter wisdom without humor). Thus, free music became to me, the most restrictive form of all. Not throwing out the bbay with the btah wtear (When I get that down, perhaps (to paraphrase a recent pm from a wise man) Bob Bb & Bob A# become an enharmonic tonic station.)), 'free improv' is part of one's postmodern palette.
10 {The artist formerly known as Bb}
Dear Bob A#,
Got to the Menuurt sbeauh penilitean di Cmabrigde Uinervtisy reference.Nice. Its circle makes my Venn diagram of this topic look like a lotus. (Excuse my elan). I will ponder the set at the intersection (Yet another annoying interdisciplinary cross-reference. Lociento.)
Bob Bb
Got to the Menuurt sbeauh penilitean di Cmabrigde Uinervtisy reference.Nice. Its circle makes my Venn diagram of this topic look like a lotus. (Excuse my elan). I will ponder the set at the intersection (Yet another annoying interdisciplinary cross-reference. Lociento.)
Bob Bb
10 {The artist formerly known as Bb}
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bobappleton
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so maybe that's it: improvisation is the higher truth. it always seemed that way because it's magic al, the opposite of a theory, un explainable.
george russell refers to "the intelligence of the heart" as "third world technology". that's another reason why he's so interesting - it's an idea that incorporates change rather than static definitions
b
george russell refers to "the intelligence of the heart" as "third world technology". that's another reason why he's so interesting - it's an idea that incorporates change rather than static definitions
b
bobappleton wrote:so maybe that's it: improvisation is the higher truth. it always seemed that way because it's magic al, the opposite of a theory, un explainable.
Opposite, but in the (Zen) sense that there is no up without down, good without evil, etc.
george russell refers to "the intelligence of the heart" as "third world technology". that's another reason why he's so interesting - it's an idea that incorporates change rather than static definitions
Lloyd Jones (author "Mister Pip) recently said, " Well, a writer gathers landscapes, doesn't he."
The composer and/or improvisor gathers landscapes, though which he/she walks, observes, becomes a part of.
Your (Bob A#) website is a landscape with rich improvisational resources, kind of like Cage score. One looks, one hears its music.
Robert Creeley's poetry sings to me (composition becomes transcription)
Steve Swallow FedEx'd the score to "Home" one looks through it like a child with a picture book, becoming part of its story.
The LCC is another, each page revealing a vertical mountain, a horizontal plane.
Patients invite one into their 'subconscious' landscape. "There's a scary monster in that cave, I'm afraid."
Composition::Improvisation. At times we stop and take pictures or sketch, at times we just become walk, and listen and see.
We (beauty & the beast) walk Sophie (six, a vision in puple against the trees, cement, sounds of traffic. "Why are the clouds following us?" "Hey, Daddy looka dere." (Jon Hendricks).
Dmaj(add 11)/Cmaj6.
Thanks for jammin,' Sr. A#. Time to modulate to a new landscape.
b
10 {The artist formerly known as Bb}
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bobappleton
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